Discussion:
OT: A petition to rescind Trump's invitation to the UK
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No mail
2025-02-28 23:13:23 UTC
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Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.

Sign the petition:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a

Rescind state visit invitation to President trump

To discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation of a state
visit to President Trump in light of the disgraceful, disrespectful and
bullying nature of the treatment of President Zelensky who represents a
sovereign state and a people battling for their survival against an
aggressor.

I want the government to present the case to the King that the
invitation represents the acceptance of aggressive, bullying politics
which favours the aggressive tactics of the oppressor while disregarding
the rights of a sovereign state to exist. Furthermore, Trump’s stance
panders to Putin and puts the international security at stake

Sign the petition
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Bob Eager
2025-02-28 23:19:41 UTC
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Permalink
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Post by No mail
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
To discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation of a state
visit to President Trump in light of the disgraceful, disrespectful and
bullying nature of the treatment of President Zelensky who represents a
sovereign state and a people battling for their survival against an
aggressor.
I want the government to present the case to the King that the
invitation represents the acceptance of aggressive, bullying politics
which favours the aggressive tactics of the oppressor while disregarding
the rights of a sovereign state to exist. Furthermore, Trump’s stance
panders to Putin and puts the international security at stake
Sign the petition
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a

I've signed anyway.

But the King should greet Zelenskyy at the airport.
--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 03:32:19 UTC
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Permalink
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
To discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation of a state
visit to President Trump in light of the disgraceful, disrespectful and
bullying nature of the treatment of President Zelensky who represents a
sovereign state and a people battling for their survival against an
aggressor.
I want the government to present the case to the King that the
invitation represents the acceptance of aggressive, bullying politics
which favours the aggressive tactics of the oppressor while disregarding
the rights of a sovereign state to exist. Furthermore, Trump’s stance
panders to Putin and puts the international security at stake
Sign the petition
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
As far as I can tell what Trump wanted was to be the smart deal maker
who cut a deal with Putin and over mastered Zelenskyy into a hot deal.

Zelensky said 'fine, but where are the guarantees'

Trump lost it and his narcissism , stupidity and childishness came to
the fore and he just looked like a spoilt baby throwing his toys out of
the pram.

And because narcissists are *never* wrong, it had to be Zelenskyy's fault..

Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.

I wouldn't be in the Kings shoes for one pico-second. What a shitty job
it is being head of state when you'd rather be walking the hounds over
the Scottish moors...

If le Grand Petomane can't be contained, he will have to go.

How and by whom will be the next popcorn picnic
--
Climate is what you expect but weather is what you get.
Mark Twain
jon
2025-03-01 08:18:25 UTC
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Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by No mail
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
To discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation of a state
visit to President Trump in light of the disgraceful, disrespectful and
bullying nature of the treatment of President Zelensky who represents a
sovereign state and a people battling for their survival against an
aggressor.
I want the government to present the case to the King that the
invitation represents the acceptance of aggressive, bullying politics
which favours the aggressive tactics of the oppressor while
disregarding the rights of a sovereign state to exist. Furthermore,
Trump’s stance panders to Putin and puts the international security at
stake
Sign the petition
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Post by The Natural Philosopher
As far as I can tell what Trump wanted was to be the smart deal maker
who cut a deal with Putin and over mastered Zelenskyy into a hot deal.
Zelensky said 'fine, but where are the guarantees'
Trump lost it and his narcissism , stupidity and childishness came to
the fore and he just looked like a spoilt baby throwing his toys out of
the pram.
And because narcissists are *never* wrong, it had to be Zelenskyy's fault..
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
I wouldn't be in the Kings shoes for one pico-second. What a shitty job
it is being head of state when you'd rather be walking the hounds over
the Scottish moors...
If le Grand Petomane can't be contained, he will have to go.
How and by whom will be the next popcorn picnic
I thought Zelensky held it fine, I would have fucked up Trump good and
proper, after saying Zelensky started the war, thats why I am not a
diplomat.
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 09:16:49 UTC
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Post by jon
I thought Zelensky held it fine, I would have fucked up Trump good and
proper, after saying Zelensky started the war, thats why I am not a
diplomat.
Yep. Ive seen this behaviour in narcissists before. Rile the other
person so much that they overreach and then you can claim 'victim' status.

It did not quite come off.
--
WOKE is an acronym... Without Originality, Knowledge or Education.
Jethro_uk
2025-03-01 09:42:28 UTC
Reply
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Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 13:04:00 UTC
Reply
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Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
--
"A point of view can be a dangerous luxury when substituted for insight
and understanding".

Marshall McLuhan
Joe
2025-03-01 17:26:14 UTC
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Permalink
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?

How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
--
Joe
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 18:01:36 UTC
Reply
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Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
--
“But what a weak barrier is truth when it stands in the way of an
hypothesis!”

Mary Wollstonecraft
charles
2025-03-01 18:45:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
presumably the one that Russia held in their occupied lands. I notice the
poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any chance
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Joe
2025-03-01 19:52:12 UTC
Reply
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On Sat, 01 Mar 25 18:45:02 UTC
Post by charles
I notice
the poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any
chance
No, Irish origin, not Eastern European, with 'ph' rather than 'f'.
Never voted left in my life.
--
Joe
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 20:08:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by charles
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
presumably the one that Russia held in their occupied lands. I notice the
poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any chance
Unusual to find a Russobot on Usenet
--
"I guess a rattlesnake ain't risponsible fer bein' a rattlesnake, but ah
puts mah heel on um jess the same if'n I catches him around mah chillun".
mm0fmf
2025-03-01 21:28:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by charles
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
presumably the one that Russia held in their occupied lands. I notice the
poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any chance
Unusual to find a Russobot on Usenet
WHS
Pancho
2025-03-01 21:40:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by charles
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
presumably the one that Russia held in their occupied lands. I notice the
poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any chance
Unusual to find a Russobot on Usenet
Joe's been around quite some time. I don't pay that much attention, but
my assumption was that he was a Reform supporter, much like you.
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-02 10:01:00 UTC
Reply
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Post by Pancho
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by charles
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
presumably the one that Russia held in their occupied lands. I notice the
poster of that bit of information was called Joe. "Stalin" by any chance
Unusual to find a Russobot on Usenet
Joe's been around quite some time. I don't pay that much attention, but
my assumption was that he was a Reform supporter, much like you.
I support whoever is in my opinion the best choice for the UK and the world.

Right now as you noted geopolitics is changing and we need fresh ideas.
Not a fascist takeover of the USA.
--
WOKE is an acronym... Without Originality, Knowledge or Education.
Joe
2025-03-01 19:49:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
--
Joe
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-01 20:09:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Blatant lie. Ukraine is at war and has every right to suspend elections.
IN opinion polls over 65% of Ukrainians support his leadership.
Have another slug of vodka Ivan. Its bedtime in St Petersburg
--
"I guess a rattlesnake ain't risponsible fer bein' a rattlesnake, but ah
puts mah heel on um jess the same if'n I catches him around mah chillun".
Jeff Gaines
2025-03-01 21:56:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Blatant lie. Ukraine is at war and has every right to suspend elections.
IN opinion polls over 65% of Ukrainians support his leadership.
Have another slug of vodka Ivan. Its bedtime in St Petersburg
Absolutely, we did the same here.
--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
By the time you can make ends meet they move the ends
SteveW
2025-03-02 22:41:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Blatant lie. Ukraine is at war and has every right to suspend elections.
IN opinion polls over 65% of Ukrainians support his leadership.
Have another slug of vodka Ivan. Its bedtime in St Petersburg
I read a few days ago, after Trump called Zelensky a dictator for not
holding elections, that the Ukrainian constitution prevents a general
election during a time of war.
Tim Streater
2025-03-01 20:43:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Don't be silly. The country's at war, under invasion, and martial law applies.
We didn't have an election during WW2, as I recall.
--
There's no obfuscated Perl contest because it's pointless.

- Jeff Polk
alan_m
2025-03-01 21:08:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tim Streater
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election. People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Don't be silly. The country's at war, under invasion, and martial law applies.
We didn't have an election during WW2, as I recall.
You also have to put this into context - Biden never won the election to
be US president and Putin always wins with 90% of the vote time and time
again.
--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
John Rumm
2025-03-02 18:34:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Post by Joe
People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/2/25/ukrainian-parliament-affirms-zelenskyys-legitimacy
--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
Tim Streater
2025-03-02 19:06:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 18:01:36 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
What general election?
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
He had no authority to permit or refuse an election.
Post by John Rumm
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Joe is full of shit.
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
People still call him 'President', but he's not the first
dictator to use that title. He does not govern with the consent of his
citizens, either the Ukrainian ones or the Russian ones.
Yes he does, and Joe continues to be full of shit.
--
Lady Astor: "If you were my husband I'd give you poison."
Churchill: "If you were my wife, I'd drink it."
Handsome Jack
2025-03-03 07:32:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Simply false. There was a general election in July 1945 while Britain was
still at war with Japan.
charles
2025-03-03 09:45:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Simply false. There was a general election in July 1945 while Britain was
still at war with Japan.
but, by that time, we did not face any more air raids - or threats of
invasion.
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
jon
2025-03-03 12:34:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by charles
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit
an election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of
marshal law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs -
which I why we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you
claim Churchill was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Simply false. There was a general election in July 1945 while Britain
was still at war with Japan.
but, by that time, we did not face any more air raids - or threats of
invasion.
I think Japan was on the brink of surrender at that time. Anyway we got
two street parties.
John Rumm
2025-03-03 12:10:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Simply false. There was a general election in July 1945 while Britain was
still at war with Japan.
and remind us in what year the previous GE was?

Now subtract one from the other... what time span do you get?
--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
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| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
mm0fmf
2025-03-03 13:35:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by John Rumm
Post by Joe
My point. Zelensky's term as President ended, and he did not permit an
election.
Their constitution does not permit elections during a period of marshal
law (as is common in many constitutions including the UKs - which I why
we held no elections for 10 years due to WWII. Would you claim Churchill
was a dictator or help no legitimacy?)
Simply false. There was a general election in July 1945 while Britain was
still at war with Japan.
"Clement Attlee, the leader of the Labour Party, refused Winston
Churchill's offer of continuing the wartime coalition until the Allied
defeat of Japan. On 15 June, King George VI dissolved Parliament, which
had been sitting for nearly ten years without an election. "
SteveW
2025-03-02 22:38:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joe
On Sat, 1 Mar 2025 13:04:00 +0000
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Well. We now know exactly what we have to deal with.
Some of us knew years ago.
No. I don't think you did.
I don't think many British people do now. How many have heard of
Victoria Nuland, or Maidan, or know why Biden's blanket pardons were
backdated to 2014? Or how many children of senior Biden politicians
(including, of course, himself) had oil company jobs in Ukraine?
How many know who won the Ukrainian General Election of May last year?
You mean the one held by the Russians? Ukraine's constitution apparently
prevents an election during martial law, in place for a war. Not that
they could have held one anyway, as Russia would have targeted any
gatherings for election meetings, voting, etc.
The Nomad
2025-03-01 09:10:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Post by No mail
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
To discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation of a state
visit to President Trump in light of the disgraceful, disrespectful and
bullying nature of the treatment of President Zelensky who represents a
sovereign state and a people battling for their survival against an
aggressor.
I want the government to present the case to the King that the
invitation represents the acceptance of aggressive, bullying politics
which favours the aggressive tactics of the oppressor while disregarding
the rights of a sovereign state to exist. Furthermore, Trump’s stance
panders to Putin and puts the international security at stake
Sign the petition
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a


<quote>

We’re checking this petition

20 people have already supported this petition. No more people can sign
this petition until it has been approved.

We need to check it meets the petition standards before we publish it.

Please try again in a few days.

</quote>

Well, lets see what happens now ...

Avpx

& I see the sig monster was paying attention again
--
'Is it heroic to die like this?' said Conina. 'I think it is,' he said,
'and when it comes to dying, there's only one opinion that matters.'
(Sourcery) Sat 11505 Sep 09:05:01 GMT 1993
09:05:01 up 1 day, 16:00, 1 user, load average: 0.65, 0.43, 0.33
Andy Burns
2025-03-01 09:14:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
alan_m
2025-03-01 09:17:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
Approved by Trump or Musk ?
--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
Jeff Gaines
2025-03-01 10:41:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by alan_m
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
Approved by Trump or Musk ?
:-)
--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
If it's not broken, mess around with it until it is
Ottavio Caruso
2025-03-01 15:08:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by alan_m
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
Approved by Trump or Musk ?
Yes.
--
Fuck Putin! Fuck Trump! Слава Україні!
Bob Eager
2025-03-01 11:42:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/no-2nd-state-visit-for-donald-
trump
--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor
David Wade
2025-03-01 11:47:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Bob Eager
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/no-2nd-state-visit-for-donald-
trump
Pointless, even official petitions get ignored...

Dave
Sam Plusnet
2025-03-01 19:35:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by David Wade
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
  https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/no-2nd-state-visit-for-donald-
trump
Pointless, even official petitions get ignored...
It didn't work when he visited the last time he was President. Not sure
how many signatures that one gained.
--
Sam Plusnet
alan_m
2025-03-01 21:10:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by David Wade
Post by Andy Burns
Post by No mail
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
"No more people can sign this petition until it has been approved"
  https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/no-2nd-state-visit-for-donald-
trump
Pointless, even official petitions get ignored...
It didn't work when he visited the last time he was President.  Not sure
how many signatures that one gained.
Possible the Petion will not be re-instated. The King invited him and
not parliament. A technical get out clause.
--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
Andy Burns
2025-03-01 21:15:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
The King invited him and not parliament. A technical get out clause.
Presumably that's why the petition was worded as

"discuss with the King the rescinding of the invitation
of a state visit to President Trump"
Pancho
2025-03-01 21:37:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
Sure, if you want to follow the Zelensky, strategy of talking tough from
a very weak position.

It seems as if the armchair warriors here are desperate to impoverish
the UK. First we have Brexit, then we have sanctions on Russia, pushing
up energy prices and causing massive inflation. Now you want to fuck off
the USA, leaving us isolated in a world that is likely to turn away from
globalisation.

The UK needs allies. Alliances are formed by compromises. We all eat a
bit of shit in our personal lives, in order to obtain a greater
offsetting advantage. Why can't people understand we need to do this in
international relations?
Tim Streater
2025-03-01 21:50:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
It seems as if the armchair warriors here are desperate to impoverish
the UK. First we have Brexit, then we have sanctions on Russia, pushing
up energy prices and causing massive inflation. Now you want to fuck off
the USA, leaving us isolated in a world that is likely to turn away from
globalisation.
I wouldn't call the inflation we had "massive". And as the Times said today,
quite likely it'll be Starmer that makes brexit "work". And anyway it already
works - we are no longer part of a corrupt and bureaucratic entity pretending
to be a European Government, but which is entirely undemocratic.
Post by Pancho
The UK needs allies.
Looks like we'll be looking for them closer to home, if EU countries actually
manage to wake up and boost their defence spending.
--
If socialism helps the poor, why are the poor in socialist countries so much poorer than the poor in capitalist countries?

Mark
Pancho
2025-03-02 11:48:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tim Streater
Post by Pancho
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
It seems as if the armchair warriors here are desperate to impoverish
the UK. First we have Brexit, then we have sanctions on Russia, pushing
up energy prices and causing massive inflation. Now you want to fuck off
the USA, leaving us isolated in a world that is likely to turn away from
globalisation.
I wouldn't call the inflation we had "massive". And as the Times said today,
quite likely it'll be Starmer that makes brexit "work". And anyway it already
works - we are no longer part of a corrupt and bureaucratic entity pretending
to be a European Government, but which is entirely undemocratic.
If you don't think Westminster is corrupt and bureaucratic too, you
haven't been paying attention. I'm also very dubious about the
democratic process in the UK. In a two party system, you just need to
establish influence/control over two power structures rather than one.
The public then only have the opportunity to vote for one party you
control or the other party which you also control.
Post by Tim Streater
Post by Pancho
The UK needs allies.
Looks like we'll be looking for them closer to home, if EU countries actually
manage to wake up and boost their defence spending.
Defence against which threat? Anyway, defence spending is mainly a red
herring if it gets pissed away on vanity projects, like aircraft
carriers. What the EU (and the World) needs is sensible political
control structures, to enable viable defence/policing operations.

Our main vulnerability is economic not military. It is dangerous to rely
on supply from a region that we have insufficient political influence
upon. On the other hand economies of scale mean the UK is too small to
do everything for itself. So we need to be part of a bigger group, both
economically and politically.

The UK needs some kind of political alliance with the EU and/or USA. The
EU,USA,China are much bigger than the UK, they can do it alone, in a way
we can't.
Tim Streater
2025-03-02 13:20:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by Tim Streater
Post by Pancho
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
It seems as if the armchair warriors here are desperate to impoverish
the UK. First we have Brexit, then we have sanctions on Russia, pushing
up energy prices and causing massive inflation. Now you want to fuck off
the USA, leaving us isolated in a world that is likely to turn away from
globalisation.
I wouldn't call the inflation we had "massive". And as the Times said today,
quite likely it'll be Starmer that makes brexit "work". And anyway it already
works - we are no longer part of a corrupt and bureaucratic entity pretending
to be a European Government, but which is entirely undemocratic.
If you don't think Westminster is corrupt and bureaucratic too, you
haven't been paying attention.
Not to the same extent. The EU has no checks and balances.
Post by Pancho
I'm also very dubious about the
democratic process in the UK. In a two party system, you just need to
establish influence/control over two power structures rather than one.
The public then only have the opportunity to vote for one party you
control or the other party which you also control.
So who has control over both then?
Post by Pancho
Post by Tim Streater
Post by Pancho
The UK needs allies.
Looks like we'll be looking for them closer to home, if EU countries actually
manage to wake up and boost their defence spending.
Defence against which threat?
If you don't think Putin's a threat, then you haven't been paying attention.
Post by Pancho
Anyway, defence spending is mainly a red herring if it gets pissed away on
vanity projects, like aircraft carriers.
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
Post by Pancho
What the EU (and the World) needs is sensible political
control structures, to enable viable defence/policing operations.
Just like we need AA batteries holding enough energy to power the entire grid
for an hour or two each.
--
"The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate technology, led them into it in the first place." - Douglas Adams
alan_m
2025-03-02 18:06:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tim Streater
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
If nothing else the Ukraine war should have taught our politicians that
expensive military hardware easily can be crippled by relatively cheap
mass drone attacks. Maybe the era of the aircraft carrier is already over.
--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
Tim Streater
2025-03-02 19:09:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by alan_m
Post by Tim Streater
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
If nothing else the Ukraine war should have taught our politicians that
expensive military hardware easily can be crippled by relatively cheap
mass drone attacks. Maybe the era of the aircraft carrier is already over.
This would apply to any naval asset, seems to me, even possibly subs. Is also
why we concentrated on conventional weapons during WW2, unlike Adolf with his
V2 (V1 was more cost effective). As the Yankee general said at the time, what
counts is getting there firstest with the mostest.
--
"Once you adopt the unix paradigm, the variants cease to be a problem - you bitch, of course, but that's because bitching is fun, unlike M$ OS's, where bitching is required to keep your head from exploding." - S Stremler in afc
SteveW
2025-03-02 22:33:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by alan_m
Post by Tim Streater
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
If nothing else the Ukraine war should have taught our politicians that
expensive military hardware easily can be crippled by relatively cheap
mass drone attacks. Maybe the era of the aircraft carrier is already over.
People said that decades ago, regarding their vulnerability to air or
missile attack, but were proved wrong.
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-03 16:03:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by SteveW
Post by alan_m
Post by Tim Streater
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
If nothing else the Ukraine war should have taught our politicians
that expensive military hardware easily can be crippled by relatively
cheap mass drone attacks. Maybe the era of the aircraft carrier is
already over.
People said that decades ago, regarding their vulnerability to air or
missile attack, but were proved wrong.
when the general Belgrano sank...

The UK was lucky in the falklands that all the Argies had were exocets,
and we had a counter to it.

Its very easy to sink any ship. With a big enough bang in the right place.

What we need are submarines packed with these

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Baby

And or surface vessels packed with these.

https://www.naval-technology.com/features/new-missile-selection-ends-uks-anti-ship-dilemma-for-now/

YankShit is impossibly expensive highly complicated has low availability
and is likely to stop working if Donald Trump says so.

You can buy 100 BAE Hawks from India for the price of one F35. And if
they had the life support removed and a bit of AI and some radio control
installed, they would make excellent general purpose kamikazi drones

And a lot of US kit is made by a UK firm - BAE. Including the excellent
Bradley Fighting Vehicle so beloved of Ukraine's soldiers
--
Karl Marx said religion is the opium of the people.
But Marxism is the crack cocaine.
Tim Streater
2025-03-03 16:13:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
The UK was lucky in the falklands that all the Argies had were exocets,
and we had a counter to it.
And a few aging fighter-bombers, can't remember what. Which were fairly
susceptible to the SideWinders we were able to get from the Yanks. Damn lucky
we had the Harriers. And a couple of smaller carriers to host them. Retiring
them was another bit of foolishness.
--
First of all, a message to English left-wing journalists and intellectuals generally: 'Do remember that dishonesty and cowardice always have to be paid for. Don't imagine that for years on end you can make yourself the boot-licking propagandist of the Soviet régime, or any other régime, and then suddenly return to mental decency. Once a whore, always a whore.'

George Orwell, 1 Sept 1944
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-03 16:47:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tim Streater
Post by The Natural Philosopher
The UK was lucky in the falklands that all the Argies had were exocets,
and we had a counter to it.
And a few aging fighter-bombers, can't remember what.
Something beginning with P IIRC... Puma? Ah no.Pucara turboprops
Soem Skyhwaks falling apart and some super etendards.
They only had 5 exocets according to wiki.
Post by Tim Streater
Which were fairly
susceptible to the SideWinders we were able to get from the Yanks. Damn lucky
we had the Harriers. And a couple of smaller carriers to host them. Retiring
them was another bit of foolishness.
Well yes, probably.

But in today's climate we need a completely new military anyway.
--
Civilization exists by geological consent, subject to change without notice.
– Will Durant
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-03 15:47:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by alan_m
Post by Tim Streater
Carriers are not vanity projects, at least in principle. Our two were, I agree
(we should have either built two smaller ones). Equally stupid was designing
them such that you then could only really use the F35, which is a stupidly
expensive plane, so you can't afford to buy many, and you can't replace them
easily.
If nothing else the Ukraine war should have taught our politicians that
expensive military hardware easily can be crippled by relatively cheap
mass drone attacks. Maybe the era of the aircraft carrier is already over.
I think it is as obsolete as 40 gun ship of the line.

AI equipped unmanned submarines that lurk and pop up a buoy every so
often to listen for instructions and relay data would be far less
expensive. Equip them with missiles Ack Ack, and in the limit a fucking
great bomb in the bows.

What Ukraine shows us that unacceptable losses in manned attack craft
are simply not an issue in unmanned. If only one in a thousand get
through, launch two thousand.
--
Gun Control: The law that ensures that only criminals have guns.
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-03 15:41:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Defence against which threat?
The EU, Russia, the USA and China.
These are all expansionist organisations that may if they can get away
with it use force of arms
Post by Pancho
Anyway, defence spending is mainly a red
herring if it gets pissed away on vanity projects, like aircraft
carriers. What the EU (and the World) needs is sensible political
control structures, to enable viable defence/policing operations.
The EU needs diusmantlyung
What Europe needs is to take a ling hard look at the war in Ukraine and
design a completely new miltary based on the experience gained.
Post by Pancho
Our main vulnerability is economic not military. It is dangerous to rely
on supply from a region that we have insufficient political influence
upon. On the other hand economies of scale mean the UK is too small to
do everything for itself. So we need to be part of a bigger group, both
economically and politically.
False logic.
remoaner drivel
We dont need common politics to ally against a common enemy
Post by Pancho
The UK needs some kind of political alliance with the EU and/or USA. The
EU,USA,China are much bigger than the UK, they can do it alone, in a way
we can't.
No. the UK needs a military alliance with people it can trust.
Australia, Canada, some of the European countries and some of the Asian
ones in the far east.
It certainly cannot trust the EU, and now it seems not the USA either

The EU is not a military power anyway and it would be deeply dangerous
to let it have an army.
--
Renewable energy: Expensive solutions that don't work to a problem that
doesn't exist instituted by self legalising protection rackets that
don't protect, masquerading as public servants who don't serve the public.
Jeff Gaines
2025-03-01 21:58:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
The UK needs allies. Alliances are formed by compromises. We all eat a bit
of shit in our personal lives, in order to obtain a greater offsetting
advantage. Why can't people understand we need to do this in international
relations?
Tell Trump and Vance, I suspect everybody else understands.
--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Captcha is thinking of stopping the use of pictures with traffic lights as
cyclists don't know what they are.
Tim Streater
2025-03-01 22:04:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jeff Gaines
The UK needs allies. Alliances are formed by compromises. We all eat a bit
of shit in our personal lives, in order to obtain a greater offsetting
advantage. Why can't people understand we need to do this in international
relations?
Tell Trump and Vance, I suspect everybody else understands.
Quite so.

Shame we've got these clowns for another four years. I hope the Democrats wake
uo and realise that its their posturing that has lumbered us with them, along
with the archaic 18th century constitution the Septics have.
--
What power have you got?
Where did you get it from?
In whose interests do you use it?
To whom are you accountable?
How do we get rid of you?

Tony Benn
The Natural Philosopher
2025-03-02 09:59:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by No mail
Apologies for politics, but what happened today in the US cannot go
unremarked. Please forward far and wide.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/719957/sponsors/new?
token=S6YHbutBwy7SoiRvqp7a
Rescind state visit invitation to President trump
Sure, if you want to follow the Zelensky, strategy of talking tough from
a very weak position.
It seems as if the armchair warriors here are desperate to impoverish
the UK. First we have Brexit, then we have sanctions on Russia, pushing
up energy prices and causing massive inflation. Now you want to fuck off
the USA, leaving us isolated in a world that is likely to turn away from
globalisation.
Amazing reverse weasel!

Now you want to fuck off the rest of the free world , leaving you
isolated in a world that is likely to now turn away from globalisation.
Post by Pancho
The UK needs allies. Alliances are formed by compromises. We all eat a
bit of shit in our personal lives, in order to obtain a greater
offsetting advantage. Why can't people understand we need to do this in
international relations?
The USA needs allies and a market place and trade to prosper
Protecting its markets is simply common sense.
Why can't people understand you need to do this in international relations?
--
WOKE is an acronym... Without Originality, Knowledge or Education.
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