Discussion:
USB Stick Oddity
(too old to reply)
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-06 12:20:24 UTC
Permalink
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.

I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.

So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.

So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??

TIA

Andrew
Andy Burns
2019-07-06 12:27:17 UTC
Permalink
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB
2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that
doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-06 12:34:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB
2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that
doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?

Andrew
The Natural Philosopher
2019-07-06 12:50:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with
USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system
that doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working one
off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.

That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as its
contents.

Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.

Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated

It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do it
in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI app for
this

Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT

OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,

OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,

OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z " is
the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to proceed/stop the
formatting


I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
--
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as
foolish, and by the rulers as useful.

(Seneca the Younger, 65 AD)
The Natural Philosopher
2019-07-06 12:58:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with
USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound
system that doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working one
off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as its
contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do it
in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI app for
this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z " is
the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to proceed/stop the
formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
Or exFAT.

Important to ID what is on the working sticks EXACTLY
--
“A leader is best When people barely know he exists. Of a good leader,
who talks little,When his work is done, his aim fulfilled,They will say,
“We did this ourselves.”

― Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching
newshound
2019-07-06 13:32:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with
USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound
system that doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working
one off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as
its contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do
it in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI
app for this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z "
is the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to
proceed/stop the formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
Or exFAT.
Important to ID what is on the working sticks EXACTLY
+1, but actually Windows does let you format in different systems
straight from file manager.

By default I format all my sticks in exFAT these days, so that my Mac
can see them too.
Brian Gaff
2019-07-06 21:20:43 UTC
Permalink
He already said he had reformatted them. I have to do this since most modern
one come ntfs by default which all our ram stick players cannot see. Fat or
fat 32 does work, but as I said we could not get the copier to copy to the
new hardware type very reliably till we changed the firmware.
Brian
--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB
2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that
doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working one
off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as its
contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do it
in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI app for
this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z " is
the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to proceed/stop the
formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
Or exFAT.
Important to ID what is on the working sticks EXACTLY
--
"A leader is best When people barely know he exists. Of a good leader,
who talks little,When his work is done, his aim fulfilled,They will say,
"We did this ourselves."
? Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching
Michael Chare
2019-07-07 17:14:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with
USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound
system that doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working
one off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as
its contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do
it in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI
app for this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z "
is the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to
proceed/stop the formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
Or exFAT.
Important to ID what is on the working sticks EXACTLY
In the past, I have used the linux gparted (gui) application to fix a
USB stick problem.
--
Michael Chare
Chris Bartram
2019-07-06 13:08:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with
USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound
system that doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working one
off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as its
contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to
choose from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do it
in windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI app for
this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z " is
the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to proceed/stop the
formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
If you're using Windows, Disk Management will show you (and let you
edit) the disk partitions and filesystem types graphically.
Brian Gaff
2019-07-06 21:17:41 UTC
Permalink
No it was not in our case it was some differently numbered NAB hardware
issue that was reported. Pcs say installing driver software, but things not
updatable will need to have their firmware changed to cope with the more
modern hardware.

I
This has been my experience on bulk copiers.
Brian
--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB
2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that
doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Could be but how do I tell?
Andrew
If you are on liux you might try 'dd'-ing the contents of a working one
off and 'dd'ing it onto a non working one.
That should sort out the foramat of the thing to be as identical as its
contents.
Remember there is FAT 12, FAT 16 , FAT 32, exFAT, NTFS and NTFS5 to choose
from.
Almost certainly it is the file system that is incompatible and re
formatting with a lefgacy one is indicated
It looks like yopu need to drop to te cxommand line dos prompt to do it in
windopws (howls of laughetr from l,iunux folks who have a GUI app for this
Type " format Z: /fs:FAT " for formatting to FAT
OR Type " format Z: /fs:FAT32 " for formatting to FAT32,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:NTFS " for formatting to NTFS,
OR Type " format Z: /fs:EXFAT " for formatting to EXFAT, where " Z " is
the letter of your Memory stick. Press Y=Yes or N=No to proceed/stop the
formatting
I'd try plain FAT or FAT16 as it is also known
--
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as foolish,
and by the rulers as useful.
(Seneca the Younger, 65 AD)
Brian Gaff
2019-07-06 21:14:18 UTC
Permalink
Not if he has formatted them, besides mostly those tend to emulate floppy
discs and are ignored by stick players.
Brian
--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by Andy Burns
I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB
2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that
doesn't even see them.
They're not sticks that have hidden encrypted partitions?
Robin
2019-07-06 12:47:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's  It's probably 5 or so years old.
As well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's
onto a Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of
having it work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for
years and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put
music onto other sticks without success - I tried a couple of
DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB  2) - they work fine
on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and
darn me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound
system doesn't see them. All  sticks that I've tried are formatted
FAT32, and I've even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the
symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any
ANCIENT Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
Off the cuff:

a. does the amp specify a maximum size for USB sticks?

b. have you compared the /actual/ size of the partitions on the
(nominally) 16 GB sticks? (I've met some which are actually larger than
the advertised size)?

c. worth trying one of the new sticks with a single 8 GB parititon?
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-06 13:04:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old.
As well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's
onto a Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of
having it work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for
years and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put
music onto other sticks without success - I tried a couple of
DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine
on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and
darn me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound
system doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32,
and I've even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms
persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any
ANCIENT Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
a. does the amp specify a maximum size for USB sticks?
b. have you compared the /actual/ size of the partitions on the (nominally)
16 GB sticks? (I've met some which are actually larger than the advertised
size)?
c. worth trying one of the new sticks with a single 8 GB parititon?
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old.
As well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's
onto a Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of
having it work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for
years and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put
music onto other sticks without success - I tried a couple of
DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine
on my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and
darn me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound
system doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32,
and I've even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms
persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any
ANCIENT Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
a. does the amp specify a maximum size for USB sticks?
b. have you compared the /actual/ size of the partitions on the (nominally)
16 GB sticks? (I've met some which are actually larger than the advertised
size)?
c. worth trying one of the new sticks with a single 8 GB parititon?
I've managed to kick start Win7 disk manager diskmgmt.msc and that reports
the partitions as 'simple' and healthy 14.91 GB primary partitions on both
the working (OLD) 16 GB Cruzer Blade and the none working (NEW) 16 GB Cruzer
Blade. I don't understand why a brand new but apparently genuine one
shouldn't be seen by the sound system but work on the PC :(

Andrew
T i m
2019-07-06 13:22:46 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 14:04:04 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
<***@please_remove_me.mawson.org.uk> wrote:

<snip>
Post by Andrew Mawson
I've managed to kick start Win7 disk manager diskmgmt.msc and that reports
the partitions as 'simple' and healthy 14.91 GB primary partitions on both
the working (OLD) 16 GB Cruzer Blade and the none working (NEW) 16 GB Cruzer
Blade. I don't understand why a brand new but apparently genuine one
shouldn't be seen by the sound system but work on the PC :(
I generally re-format any such media either 1) in the device it's
going to be based in, assuming you can and / or 2) format it on a PC
with whatever FS suites the intended need.

Like I just got 4 x 32GB Samsung uSD cards and the first thing I did
was reformat them on my PC (XP in this case) and then run H2testw on
them to make sure they are genuine (size) etc.

In this case the first one was going to be supporting Raspbian on a
RPi and so when it's imaged it could change the FS / partitioning in
any case.

Cheers, T i m
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-06 14:11:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by T i m
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 14:04:04 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
<snip>
Post by Andrew Mawson
I've managed to kick start Win7 disk manager diskmgmt.msc and that reports
the partitions as 'simple' and healthy 14.91 GB primary partitions on both
the working (OLD) 16 GB Cruzer Blade and the none working (NEW) 16 GB Cruzer
Blade. I don't understand why a brand new but apparently genuine one
shouldn't be seen by the sound system but work on the PC :(
I generally re-format any such media either 1) in the device it's
going to be based in, assuming you can and / or 2) format it on a PC
with whatever FS suites the intended need.
Like I just got 4 x 32GB Samsung uSD cards and the first thing I did
was reformat them on my PC (XP in this case) and then run H2testw on
them to make sure they are genuine (size) etc.
In this case the first one was going to be supporting Raspbian on a
RPi and so when it's imaged it could change the FS / partitioning in
any case.
Cheers, T i m
OK I've re-formatted the non-working new stick as FAT32 (which is what it
was and also what the working ones are) but the symptoms remain the same,
works OK on the PC but the music player fails to see it, so still very odd.
Windows disk manager shows them both the same as having a single primary
partition of 14.91 GB.

It almost looks like an electrical / interface issue - still mighty puzzled
and in need of help ! And no I have no Unix systems nor the knowledge to
drive them if I did :(

Andrew
The Natural Philosopher
2019-07-06 16:04:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by T i m
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 14:04:04 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
<snip>
Post by Andrew Mawson
I've managed to kick start Win7 disk manager diskmgmt.msc and that reports
the partitions as 'simple'  and healthy 14.91 GB primary partitions
on both
the working (OLD) 16 GB Cruzer Blade and the none working (NEW) 16 GB Cruzer
Blade. I don't understand why a brand new but apparently genuine one
shouldn't be seen by the sound system but work on the PC :(
I generally re-format any such media either 1) in the device it's
going to be based in, assuming you can and / or 2) format it on a PC
with whatever FS suites the intended need.
Like I just got 4 x 32GB Samsung uSD cards and the first thing I did
was reformat them on my PC (XP in this case) and then run H2testw on
them to make sure they are genuine (size) etc.
In this case the first one was going to be supporting Raspbian on a
RPi and so when it's imaged it could change the FS / partitioning in
any case.
Cheers, T i m
OK I've re-formatted the non-working new stick as FAT32 (which is what
it was and also what the working ones are) but the symptoms remain the
same, works OK on the PC but the music player fails to see it, so still
very odd. Windows disk manager shows them both the same as having a
single primary partition of 14.91 GB.
It almost looks like an electrical / interface issue
yes, I agree.

Maybe its more power hungry.Maybe its USB3 and the audio kit only
understands USB2. and its not as backass compatible as it is supposed to be
Post by Andrew Mawson
- still mighty
puzzled and in need of help ! And no I have no Unix systems nor the
knowledge to drive them if I did :(
Linux not relevant - its just easier to dig deeper with the linux tools
Post by Andrew Mawson
Andrew
--
"The great thing about Glasgow is that if there's a nuclear attack it'll
look exactly the same afterwards."

Billy Connolly
newshound
2019-07-06 16:15:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by T i m
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 14:04:04 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
<snip>
Post by Andrew Mawson
I've managed to kick start Win7 disk manager diskmgmt.msc and that reports
the partitions as 'simple'  and healthy 14.91 GB primary partitions
on both
the working (OLD) 16 GB Cruzer Blade and the none working (NEW) 16 GB Cruzer
Blade. I don't understand why a brand new but apparently genuine one
shouldn't be seen by the sound system but work on the PC :(
I generally re-format any such media either 1) in the device it's
going to be based in, assuming you can and / or 2) format it on a PC
with whatever FS suites the intended need.
Like I just got 4 x 32GB Samsung uSD cards and the first thing I did
was reformat them on my PC (XP in this case) and then run H2testw on
them to make sure they are genuine (size) etc.
In this case the first one was going to be supporting Raspbian on a
RPi and so when it's imaged it could change the FS / partitioning in
any case.
Cheers, T i m
OK I've re-formatted the non-working new stick as FAT32 (which is what
it was and also what the working ones are) but the symptoms remain the
same, works OK on the PC but the music player fails to see it, so still
very odd. Windows disk manager shows them both the same as having a
single primary partition of 14.91 GB.
It almost looks like an electrical / interface issue - still mighty
puzzled and in need of help ! And no I have no Unix systems nor the
knowledge to drive them if I did :(
Andrew
Something non-compliant in the music player, fighting with a tighter
spec in the new sticks would be my guess.

Still could be worth trying different formats for the new sticks. I
*assume* the music player does not have an option to "format new media"
(in the way that cameras always do).
Brian Gaff
2019-07-06 21:24:25 UTC
Permalink
Format them to plain old fat. That might work but of course it will only be
any good on the smaller sticks.
Brian
--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's
onto a Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of
having it work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for
years and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put
music onto other sticks without success - I tried a couple of
DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on
my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and
darn me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound
system doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32,
and I've even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms
persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any
ANCIENT Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
a. does the amp specify a maximum size for USB sticks?
b. have you compared the /actual/ size of the partitions on the
(nominally) 16 GB sticks? (I've met some which are actually larger than
the advertised size)?
c. worth trying one of the new sticks with a single 8 GB parititon?
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
Caecilius
2019-07-06 16:06:22 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 13:20:24 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
In addition to the useful answers mentioning possible extra
partitions, maximum partition sizes and supported filesystems, another
difference between old drives and newer drives is the offset to the
first partition.

Drives formatted on older OSes like Windows XP used to start the first
partition on sector 63, which with 512-byte sectors gave an offset of
31KB. Here's an example of an old 32GB USB drive:

DISKPART> list part

Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 28 GB 31 KB

Since Windows 7 (or maybe Vista), the offset has been 1MB (1024KB).
E.g. on a fairly new 64-GB USB stick:

DISKPART> list part

Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 57 GB 1024 KB

Both are compatable with operating systems that implement the MBR
specification correctly. But simple old devices might hard-code the
sector 63 start, causing problems with recent USB sticks.
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-06 16:22:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 13:20:24 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
In addition to the useful answers mentioning possible extra
partitions, maximum partition sizes and supported filesystems, another
difference between old drives and newer drives is the offset to the
first partition.
Drives formatted on older OSes like Windows XP used to start the first
partition on sector 63, which with 512-byte sectors gave an offset of
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 28 GB 31 KB
Since Windows 7 (or maybe Vista), the offset has been 1MB (1024KB).
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 57 GB 1024 KB
Both are compatable with operating systems that implement the MBR
specification correctly. But simple old devices might hard-code the
sector 63 start, causing problems with recent USB sticks.
Now that sounds quite promising - how do I see the partition info at that
low level - presumably at the command prompts somehow?

Reading the printing on the new 'sticks' they call themselves "Cruzer SparK"
but were advertised as Blades, whereas the older ones call themselves
"Cruzer Blade" Perhaps just marketing speel?

Andrew
Caecilius
2019-07-06 16:31:08 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:22:07 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
Now that sounds quite promising - how do I see the partition info at that
low level - presumably at the command prompts somehow?
Assuming Windows 10:

1. Start an elevated command prompt (right-click CMD.EXE and select
"Run as Administrator").
2. Run DISKPART
3. Type LIST DISK to list the available disks
4. Type SELECT DISK N where N is the number of the disk you want to
interrogate.
5. Type LIST PART to list the partitions
6. Type EXIT when done
T i m
2019-07-06 19:14:49 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:22:07 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
<***@please_remove_me.mawson.org.uk> wrote:

<snip>
Post by Andrew Mawson
Now that sounds quite promising - how do I see the partition info at that
low level - presumably at the command prompts somehow?
Gparted from a Linux boot USB / DVD is a handy tool for such things.

Have you got / tried these tools OOI?

https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter/

https://www.techspot.com/downloads/6582-hp-usb-disk-storage-format-tool.html

https://www.softpedia.com/get/System/System-Miscellaneous/H2testw.shtml

Might be worth a go (or to keep in your portable media toolbox). ;-)

Cheers, T i m
The Natural Philosopher
2019-07-06 16:29:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 13:20:24 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
In addition to the useful answers mentioning possible extra
partitions, maximum partition sizes and supported filesystems, another
difference between old drives and newer drives is the offset to the
first partition.
Drives formatted on older OSes like Windows XP used to start the first
partition on sector 63, which with 512-byte sectors gave an offset of
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 28 GB 31 KB
Since Windows 7 (or maybe Vista), the offset has been 1MB (1024KB).
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 57 GB 1024 KB
Both are compatable with operating systems that implement the MBR
specification correctly. But simple old devices might hard-code the
sector 63 start, causing problems with recent USB sticks.
dd would fix that.

The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one

Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone

dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
--
Microsoft : the best reason to go to Linux that ever existed.
Caecilius
2019-07-06 16:57:32 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:29:50 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
dd would fix that.
The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one
Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
If you don't mind losing the contents, you can just reformat with the
appropriate partition alignment settings. Both Windows (DISKPART) and
Linux (parted) allow the alignment to be specified at partition
creation time.
The Natural Philosopher
2019-07-06 18:07:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:29:50 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
dd would fix that.
The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one
Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
If you don't mind losing the contents, you can just reformat with the
appropriate partition alignment settings. Both Windows (DISKPART) and
Linux (parted) allow the alignment to be specified at partition
creation time.
Ah. never had the need to do that.
I like te idea of dd becausse it is pretty much the option that ensures
thet the byte patterns are identical. If that doesnt work its 99% sure
to be a hardware issue and no point in wasting more time on software fixes.
--
Climate Change: Socialism wearing a lab coat.
Caecilius
2019-07-07 12:15:59 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 19:07:08 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:29:50 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
dd would fix that.
The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one
Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
If you don't mind losing the contents, you can just reformat with the
appropriate partition alignment settings. Both Windows (DISKPART) and
Linux (parted) allow the alignment to be specified at partition
creation time.
Ah. never had the need to do that.
I like te idea of dd becausse it is pretty much the option that ensures
thet the byte patterns are identical. If that doesnt work its 99% sure
to be a hardware issue and no point in wasting more time on software fixes.
Yes, creating an exact byte-for-byte copy is an advantage of dd.

It's got some inherent limitations due to its method of operation,
like being unable to expand or shrink filesystems (which can be more
of a problem than you think, because even drives that are nominaly the
same size are normally not *exactly* the same size). But it's an
impressive tool given that it's about 45 years old.
Bob Eager
2019-07-07 13:57:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Caecilius
Yes, creating an exact byte-for-byte copy is an advantage of dd.
It's got some inherent limitations due to its method of operation, like
being unable to expand or shrink filesystems (which can be more of a
problem than you think, because even drives that are nominaly the same
size are normally not *exactly* the same size). But it's an impressive
tool given that it's about 45 years old.
And I still like the piss-take user interface.
--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor
Andrew Mawson
2019-07-07 17:04:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 19:07:08 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:29:50 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
dd would fix that.
The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one
Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
If you don't mind losing the contents, you can just reformat with the
appropriate partition alignment settings. Both Windows (DISKPART) and
Linux (parted) allow the alignment to be specified at partition
creation time.
Ah. never had the need to do that.
I like te idea of dd becausse it is pretty much the option that ensures
thet the byte patterns are identical. If that doesnt work its 99% sure
to be a hardware issue and no point in wasting more time on software fixes.
Yes, creating an exact byte-for-byte copy is an advantage of dd.
It's got some inherent limitations due to its method of operation,
like being unable to expand or shrink filesystems (which can be more
of a problem than you think, because even drives that are nominaly the
same size are normally not *exactly* the same size). But it's an
impressive tool given that it's about 45 years old.
OK I've dug out an old XP system - reformatted the USB stick re-copied and
no change the MP3 boogey box still doesn't see it.

SO, I've also dug out a copy of Linux MINT on CD and tried the 'dd' clone
that was suggested, but I'm getting 'access denied' on the source USB stick
which I don't understand. So I've used the gui 'format USB Stick' under mint
on of of the new sticks which ran ok so then copied MP3 files onto it but it
still isn't seen by the boom box :( :(

argh . . . . !

Andrew
Caecilius
2019-07-07 17:11:58 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 18:04:59 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 19:07:08 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
Post by Caecilius
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 17:29:50 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
Post by The Natural Philosopher
dd would fix that.
The sequence would be to boot lunux from a live dvd, and use dd to copy
the entire usb disk including partition info, and then use dd to pop it
back onto a new one
Or if you have enmough USB ports do a stick to stick clone
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc BS=4096 or whatever the actual usb sticks end
up as
If you don't mind losing the contents, you can just reformat with the
appropriate partition alignment settings. Both Windows (DISKPART) and
Linux (parted) allow the alignment to be specified at partition
creation time.
Ah. never had the need to do that.
I like te idea of dd becausse it is pretty much the option that ensures
thet the byte patterns are identical. If that doesnt work its 99% sure
to be a hardware issue and no point in wasting more time on software fixes.
Yes, creating an exact byte-for-byte copy is an advantage of dd.
It's got some inherent limitations due to its method of operation,
like being unable to expand or shrink filesystems (which can be more
of a problem than you think, because even drives that are nominaly the
same size are normally not *exactly* the same size). But it's an
impressive tool given that it's about 45 years old.
OK I've dug out an old XP system - reformatted the USB stick re-copied and
no change the MP3 boogey box still doesn't see it.
Reformatting the memory stick will just re-create the filesystem on
the existing partition. If the partition alignment is the problem (a
big if), this won't fix the problem.

What you'd need to do is to delete the existing partition and then
recreate it with the "correct" (for your media player) alignment and
then format that to create the filesystem.

I realise I'd been a bit sloppy in calling re-partitioning
"reformatting" in my earlier post - sorry for that.
Post by Andrew Mawson
SO, I've also dug out a copy of Linux MINT on CD and tried the 'dd' clone
that was suggested, but I'm getting 'access denied' on the source USB stick
which I don't understand. So I've used the gui 'format USB Stick' under mint
on of of the new sticks which ran ok so then copied MP3 files onto it but it
still isn't seen by the boom box :( :(
You probably need:

sudo dd ...

Because you need to be root to access the raw device.

https://xkcd.com/149/
Post by Andrew Mawson
argh . . . . !
Andrew
Robin
2019-07-06 16:45:41 UTC
Permalink
On 06/07/2019 17:06, Caecilius wrote:

<snip>
Post by Caecilius
In addition to the useful answers mentioning possible extra
partitions, maximum partition sizes and supported filesystems, another
difference between old drives and newer drives is the offset to the
first partition.
Drives formatted on older OSes like Windows XP used to start the first
partition on sector 63, which with 512-byte sectors gave an offset of
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 28 GB 31 KB
Since Windows 7 (or maybe Vista), the offset has been 1MB (1024KB).
DISKPART> list part
Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 57 GB 1024 KB
Both are compatable with operating systems that implement the MBR
specification correctly. But simple old devices might hard-code the
sector 63 start, causing problems with recent USB sticks.
from a "32 GB" Samsung USB3, formatted FAT32 in Windows 10 here:

DISKPART> list part

Partition ### Type Size Offset
------------- ---------------- ------- -------
Partition 1 Primary 29 GB 112 KB
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
Chris Hogg
2019-07-06 16:37:02 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 6 Jul 2019 13:20:24 +0100, "Andrew Mawson"
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
My recently purchased Cruzer blade sticks had a built-in security
arrangement, which meant when I copied something onto them from one
computer and tried to see it in another, there was nothing there.

The solution was to put the stick back into the original computer and
delete the security files and folders and the file I'd originally
copied. I recopied the file I wanted to copy to the second computer
back onto the stick, and everything worked fine on both computers
after that.
--
Chris
Steve
2019-07-06 18:59:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto a
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having it
work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for years
and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put music onto
other sticks without success - I tried a couple of DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3
(but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on my PC but NOT on the
portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and darn
me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound system
doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32, and I've
even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
I have a similar problem with Sandisk ultra sticks. The
older one I have works ok as a OTG stick for my
mobiles, but newer ones don't. I was using them for
TWRP backups. But I stumbled across something that
works all the times in all my mobiles and that is a
micro sd card in a usb adaptor.
Brian Gaff
2019-07-06 21:13:10 UTC
Permalink
I had to get a ramstick multi way copiers firmware updated last year to
cope with the more modern hardware. On a pc you can simply get different
drivers, but on old fixed gear there is little you can do unless there is
updated firmware made for it. Their web site might have it.
Brian
--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by Andrew Mawson
I have a 'New Jersey Sound' NJA 240 portable sound system that I use for
background music at parties and bbq's It's probably 5 or so years old. As
well as audio input sockets it has a USB input, and I copy (rip) CD's onto
a Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks as a convenient way of having
it work unattended.
I have two Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks that I've had for
years and they work faultlessly. But recently I've been trying to put
music onto other sticks without success - I tried a couple of
DataTraveller 64 GB USB 3 (but compatible with USB 2) - they work fine on
my PC but NOT on the portable sound system that doesn't even see them.
So I ordered up some more Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB USB 2.0 sticks and
darn me they give the same issue. Fine playing on my PC but the sound
system doesn't see them. All sticks that I've tried are formatted FAT32,
and I've even tried re-formatting them FAT32 again but the symptoms
persist.
So what the heck is happening - anyone any ideas or has anyone any ANCIENT
Sandisk Cruzer Blade 16 GB sticks that I could try ??
TIA
Andrew
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