Discussion:
OT: Vaccine causes virus mutations?
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Commander Kinsey
2021-06-07 16:20:46 UTC
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Permalink
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Peeler
2021-06-07 17:04:32 UTC
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Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 17:20:46 +0100, Birdbrain Macaw (aka "Commander Kinsey",
"James Wilkinson", "Steven Wanker","Bruce Farquar", "Fred Johnson, etc.),
the pathological resident idiot and attention whore of all the uk ngs,
blathered again:

<FLUSH the subnormal sociopathic trolling attention whore's latest
attention-baiting sick bullshit unread again>
--
Tony944 addressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I seen and heard many people but you are on top of list being first class
ass hole jerk. ...You fit under unconditional Idiot and should be put in
mental institution.
MID: <VLCdnYC5HK1Z4S3FnZ2dnUU7-***@giganews.com>
--
Pelican to Birdbrain Macaw:
"Ok. I'm persuaded . You are an idiot."
MID: <obru31$nao$***@dont-email.me>
--
DerbyDad03 addressing Birdbrain Macaw (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
"Frigging Idiot. Get the hell out of my thread."
MID: <4d907253-b3b9-40d4-be4d-***@googlegroups.com>
--
Kerr Mudd-John about Birdbrain Macaw (now "Commander Kinsey LOL):
"It's like arguing with a demented frog."
MID: <***@dell3100.workgroup>
--
Mr Pounder Esquire about Birdbrain Macaw (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
"the piss poor delivery boy with no hot running water, 11 cats and
several parrots living in his hovel."
MID: <odqtgc$iug$***@dont-email.me>
--
Rob Morley about Birdbrain:
"He's a perennial idiot"
MID: <***@Mars>
--
JoeyDee to Birdbrain
"I apologize for thinking you were a jerk. You're just someone with an IQ
lower than your age, and I accept that as a reason for your comments."
MID: <***@news.eternal-september.org>
--
Sam Plusnet about Birdbrain (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
"He's just desperate to be noticed. Any attention will do, no matter how
negative it may be."
MID: <***@brightview.co.uk>
--
***@gmail.com asking Birdbrain:
"What, were you dropped on your head as a child?"
MID: <58ddfad5-d9a5-4031-b91f-***@googlegroups.com>
--
Christie addressing endlessly driveling Birdbrain Macaw (now "Commander
Kinsey" LOL):
"What are you resurrecting that old post of mine for? It's from last
month some time. You're like a dog who's just dug up an old bone they
hid in the garden until they were ready to have another go at it."
MID: <***@news.eternal-september.org>
--
Mr Pounder's fitting description of Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are a well known fool, a tosser, a pillock, a stupid unemployable
sponging failure who will always live alone and will die alone. You will not
be missed."
MID: <orree6$on2$***@dont-email.me>
--
Richard to pathetic wanker Hucker:
"You haven't bred?
Only useful thing you've done in your pathetic existence."
MID: <orvctf$l5m$***@gioia.aioe.org>
--
***@snyder.on.ca about Birdbrain (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
""not the sharpest knife in the drawer"'s parents sure made a serious
mistake having him born alive -- A total waste of oxygen, food, space,
and bandwidth."
MID: <***@4ax.com>
--
Mr Pounder exposing sociopathic Birdbrain:
"You will always be a lonely sociopath living in a shithole with no hot
running water with loads of stinking cats and a few parrots."
MID: <os5m1i$8m1$***@dont-email.me>
--
francis about Birdbrain (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
"He seems to have a reputation as someone of limited intelligence"
MID: <cf06cdd9-8bb8-469c-800a-***@googlegroups.com>
--
Peter Moylan about Birdbrain (now "Commander Kinsey" LOL):
"If people like JWS didn't exist, we would have to find some other way to
explain the concept of "invincible ignorance"."
MID: <otofc8$tbg$***@dont-email.me>
--
Lewis about nym-shifting Birdbrain:
"Typical narcissist troll, thinks his shit is so grand he has the right to
try to force it on everyone."<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest
trollshit unread>
MID: <***@jaka.local>
Commander Kinsey
2021-06-07 17:22:25 UTC
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Permalink
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Richard
2021-06-07 17:34:11 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything.  It's an undirected
process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant.  Anything that
wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Compared to you, it is intelligent.
Chris Bacon
2021-06-07 17:55:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Richard
Post by Commander Kinsey
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Compared to you, it is intelligent.
Does this person ever post anything DIY related, or am I safe to plonk
the "rissole"?

Perhaps someone will post the contents of their killfile, so I can copy
it. That would be helpful. It used to be that uk.d-i-y was not a general
chat group populated by such a proportion of wanackers (name deprecated
though).
Joey
2021-06-07 21:47:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Chris Bacon
Post by Richard
Post by Commander Kinsey
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Compared to you, it is intelligent.
Does this person ever post anything DIY related,
Nope.
Post by Chris Bacon
or am I safe to plonk the "rissole"?
Yep.
Peeler
2021-06-07 22:26:02 UTC
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Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 07:47:45 +1000, Joey, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:


<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Richard addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"Shit you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID: <ogoa38$pul$***@news.mixmin.net>
Richard
2021-06-08 04:49:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Chris Bacon
Post by Richard
Post by Commander Kinsey
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting
a speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Compared to you, it is intelligent.
Does this person ever post anything DIY related,
Nope.
Post by Chris Bacon
or am I safe to plonk the "rissole"?
Yep.
Well, the chances of two being wrong are smaller than the chance of one
being wrong. TYVM. *Plonked*.
I'd still like o see a good killfile config.
Irony - complains about non-DIY posts, has to ask other people to make
up his mind and can't do his own killfile.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Newsgroup_access_tips#Message_Filters

HTH
Chris Bacon
2021-06-08 08:04:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Richard
I'd still like o see a good killfile config.
Irony - complains about non-DIY posts, has to ask other people to make
up his mind and can't do his own killfile.
Fancy re-inventing the wheel, Richard? I don't.
Post by Richard
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Newsgroup_access_tips#Message_Filters
Didn't know about it. Have already got several killfiled.
Post by Richard
HTH
Ta.
Andy Burns
2021-06-08 07:00:49 UTC
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Permalink
I'd still like o see a good killfile config.
Everyone having a single killfile is like having a single vaccine, it
makes it easier for the troll/vaccine to mutate ...
John Rumm
2021-06-08 10:35:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Chris Bacon
Post by Richard
Post by Commander Kinsey
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Compared to you, it is intelligent.
Does this person ever post anything DIY related,
What PHUCKER? There was a time that was his preferred method of trolling
- ask a DIY related question, wait for the answers, then spend ages
arguing with the answers! It was like trolling, but I think he missed
the art of standing back and lettings the flame wars run themselves!
Post by Chris Bacon
or am I safe to plonk
the "rissole"?
I have never felt any sense of loss :-)
Post by Chris Bacon
Perhaps someone will post the contents of their killfile, so I can copy
it. That would be helpful. It used to be that uk.d-i-y was not a general
chat group populated by such a proportion of wanackers (name deprecated
though).
Its probably better to build one from first principles since one size
will not fit all.
--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 18:08:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Reality is nothing like that. Viruses cant do that.
Peeler
2021-06-07 18:57:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 04:08:49 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the two subnormal sociopathic cretins' endless absolutely idiotic
blather>
--
TYPICAL retarded "conversation" between sociopath Rodent and sociopath
Birdbrain from August 26th 2018:

Birdbrain: "I have one head but 5 fingers."

Senile Rodent: "Obvious lie. You hairy legged cross dressers are so inbred
that you all have two heads."

Birdbrain: "You're the one that likes hairy legs remember?"

Senile Rodent: "The problem isnt the hairy legs, it's the gross inbreeding
that
produces two headed unemployables like you."

Birdbrain: "So why did you mention hairy legs?"

Senile Rodent: "Because that's what those who arent actually stupid enough
to shave their legs have."

Birdbrain: "You only have hairy legs if both of the following are true:
1) You're quite far back on the evolutionary scale.
2) You haven't learned what a razor is for."

Senile Rodent: "Only a terminal fuckwit or a woman shaves their legs."

Birdbrain: "There is literally zero point in having hair all over your
body."

Senile Rodent: "There is even less point in wasting your time changing what
you are born with."

MID: <***@mid.individual.net>
Snit
2021-06-07 19:14:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Jun 7, 2021 at 10:22:25 AM MST, ""Commander Kinsey"" wrot
Post by Commander Kinsey
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances o
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using i
sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by
vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting
speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Only intelligent compared to Republicans.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Peeler
2021-06-07 20:21:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 19:14:54 GMT, Shit the git, the notorious,
Post by Snit
Only intelligent compared to Republicans.
Thanks, Shit the Git, you abnormal troll-feeding senile democRat, for making
the clinically insane troll's latest idiotic thread a huge success on these
groups!
Tim Streater
2021-06-07 20:30:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a speedtrap and driving on a different route.
You're shaping up to be a worse troll than T r o l l, and AISB, that's a
high bar.
--
If socialism helps the poor, why are the poor in socialist countries so much
poorer than the poor in capitalist countries?

Mark
micky
2021-06-08 16:39:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Jun 2021 18:22:25 +0100, "Commander
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Anyone who wrote that was either speaking metaphorically, or he was
uninformed, or he was lying.

People sometimes try to speak in words that will be meaningful to
non-specialists. Sometimes they choose the wrong metaphor entiredly,
one that doesn't even illustrate the comparison they are trying to make,
but more often the metaphor illustrates something but either the writer
or his readers expand it beyond what the facts are.

I don't know what happened here, but the vaccine reduces mutations
enormously. It does not increase them.

It reduces them by not providing a host human in which the virus can
grow (and mutate) and by, it seems clear now, reducing, eliminating, or
almost eliminating transmission to other people. Again, tremendously
reducting the number of host humans in which the virus can grow and
sometimes mutate.

Even children under 12 can get the virus, and some are made sick from
it, some seriuosly sick. They're testing sample populations to see if
the vaccine has side effects more than what adults get. Assuming the
tests show they don't. Thos childdren should be vaccinated too.

It's a shame that those who have had organ transplants, for example,
can't be vaccinated or in the case of a good friend of mine** who had a
kidney tranplant about 7 years ago, can be vaccinated but didn't develop
antibodies, at least not the one that the standard PCR test test for .
But other than those special situations, everyone should be vaccinated,
and that will come closest to stopping mutations.

**She had lymphoma is 2002 and had some of her own bone marrow removed,
the rest was irradiated and killed, and hers was replaced. Every day
she lives she sets a new record for survival of this procedure which
iirc was at most 7 years when she got it, 19 years ago.

Then she had kidney failure and one of her 3 sons gave her one of his
kidneys. The son is fine.

Then 2 or 3 years ago she had breast cancer.

So your statement above is the exact opposite of the truth. I believe
you that you read it, and didn't make it up, but beside the likelihood
that it's a misunderstood metaphor, it may also be a lie. It's part of
the Big Lie technique to say the very opposite of the truth. The harder
it is to believe the better in that case because people who normally
tell the truth often think, NO one woudl make up such a ridiculous lie
so it must be true.
Peeler
2021-06-08 17:11:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 08 Jun 2021 12:39:18 -0400, micky mouse, the notorious,
Post by micky
Anyone who wrote that was either speaking metaphorically, or he was
uninformed, or he was lying.
Or he is simply a filthy trolling attention whore, you mentally handicapped
troll-feeding senile ASSHOLE!
Bob F
2021-06-08 17:33:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by micky
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Jun 2021 18:22:25 +0100, "Commander
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Microorganisms don't mutate to "avoid" anything. It's an undirected process
whereby anything that survives (whether it's antibodies produced by a vaccine
or an antibacterial such as penicillin) is resistant. Anything that wasn't
resistant is dead.
I've read that this virus is intelligent, like a motorist spotting a speedtrap and driving on a different route.
Anyone who wrote that was either speaking metaphorically, or he was
uninformed, or he was lying.
People sometimes try to speak in words that will be meaningful to
non-specialists. Sometimes they choose the wrong metaphor entiredly,
one that doesn't even illustrate the comparison they are trying to make,
but more often the metaphor illustrates something but either the writer
or his readers expand it beyond what the facts are.
I don't know what happened here, but the vaccine reduces mutations
enormously. It does not increase them.
It reduces them by not providing a host human in which the virus can
grow (and mutate) and by, it seems clear now, reducing, eliminating, or
almost eliminating transmission to other people. Again, tremendously
reducting the number of host humans in which the virus can grow and
sometimes mutate.
Even children under 12 can get the virus, and some are made sick from
it, some seriuosly sick. They're testing sample populations to see if
the vaccine has side effects more than what adults get. Assuming the
tests show they don't. Thos childdren should be vaccinated too.
It's a shame that those who have had organ transplants, for example,
can't be vaccinated or in the case of a good friend of mine** who had a
kidney tranplant about 7 years ago, can be vaccinated but didn't develop
antibodies, at least not the one that the standard PCR test test for .
But other than those special situations, everyone should be vaccinated,
and that will come closest to stopping mutations.
**She had lymphoma is 2002 and had some of her own bone marrow removed,
the rest was irradiated and killed, and hers was replaced. Every day
she lives she sets a new record for survival of this procedure which
iirc was at most 7 years when she got it, 19 years ago.
Then she had kidney failure and one of her 3 sons gave her one of his
kidneys. The son is fine.
Then 2 or 3 years ago she had breast cancer.
So your statement above is the exact opposite of the truth. I believe
you that you read it, and didn't make it up, but beside the likelihood
that it's a misunderstood metaphor, it may also be a lie. It's part of
the Big Lie technique to say the very opposite of the truth. The harder
it is to believe the better in that case because people who normally
tell the truth often think, NO one woudl make up such a ridiculous lie
so it must be true.
Kind of like if someone had made a movie 10 years ago about a
"president" like trump, everyone would have said it was too stupid to be
believable.
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 18:05:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Peeler
2021-06-07 18:58:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 04:05:10 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the two subnormal sociopathic cretins' endless absolutely idiotic
blather>
--
Typical retarded "conversation" between the Scottish wanker and the senile
Ozzietard:

Birdbrain: "Horse shit doesn't stink."

Senile Rodent: "It does if you roll in it."

Birdbrain: "I've never worked out why, I assumed it was maybe meateaters
that made stinky shit, but then why does vegetarian human shit stink? Is it
just the fact that we're capable of digesting meat?"

Senile Rodent: "Nope, some cow shit stinks too."

Message-ID: <***@mid.individual.net>
Snit
2021-06-07 19:22:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 19:44:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Snit
2021-06-07 20:02:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
See in the news they will be lifting restrictions. The current threshold
for herd immunity is 70%. They are just about there.

Heard it from the wife of a doctor doing research in New York — but it
might not be official.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Peeler
2021-06-07 20:34:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 20:02:07 GMT, Shit the git, the notorious,
Post by Snit
See in the news they will be lifting restrictions. The current threshold
for herd immunity is 70%. They are just about there.
See, you will be feeding ANY useless, idiotic troll and trash ANY ngs with
your ALWAYS off topic endless senile shit, in your typical selfish manner,
you typical self-complacent democRat! QED!
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 22:15:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
See in the news they will be lifting restrictions.
The current threshold for herd immunity is 70%.
That number isnt certain yet, it depends on the
basic reproduction number of the disease and
that varys with the strain and it is known that
the more recent more virulent strains have worse
basic reproduction numbers and so the threshold
for herd immunity needed will be much higher
than 70%, well into the 90%s in fact.
Post by Snit
They are just about there.
Nope.
Post by Snit
Heard it from the wife of a doctor doing research in New York
She mangled the real story.
Post by Snit
— but it might not be official.
It definitely isnt.
Peeler
2021-06-07 22:22:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 08:15:09 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the two abnormal senile assholes' latest idiotic, senile blather>
--
Marland answering senile Rodent's statement, "I don't leak":
"That’s because so much piss and shite emanates from your gob that there is
nothing left to exit normally, your arsehole has clammed shut through disuse
and the end of prick is only clear because you are such a Wanker."
Message-ID: <***@mid.individual.net>
Snit
2021-06-07 23:08:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.

Need 70% to get to herd immunity:


https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html

New York close to 70%


https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose

That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will still not
be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 23:24:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in infected
people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the chance of it
mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
Its nothing like that simple now with the new more virulent strains.
Post by Snit
https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html
That doesn’t say that it only needs to get to 70%.
Post by Snit
New York close to 70%
Even that isnt clear.
Post by Snit
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose
That isnt saying that its close to 70%.
Post by Snit
That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will still
not be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
And there is no evidence that the 70% is the required level.
Snit
2021-06-07 23:35:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Jun 7, 2021 at 4:24:07 PM MST, ""Rod Speed"" wrot
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in infected
people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the chance of it
mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
Its nothing like that simple now with the new more virulent strains.
That is what I thought, but I have found multiple sources saying 70% is wha
they think would do it. In the past I had seen 80-90%.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html
That doesn’t say that it only needs to get to 70%.
"What we know about coronavirus so far suggests that, if we were really to g
back to a pre-pandemic lifestyle, we would need at least 70% of the populatio
to be immune to keep the rate of infection down (“achieve herd immunity”
without restrictions on activities."
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
New York close to 70%
Even that isnt clear.
Post by Snit
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose
That isnt saying that its close to 70%.
Post by Snit
That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will still
not be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
And there is no evidence that the 70% is the required level.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 00:02:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New
York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
Its nothing like that simple now with the new more virulent strains.
That is what I thought,
That’s what is known.
Post by Snit
but I have found multiple sources saying 70% is what they think would do
it.
None that base that on any rigorous science.
Post by Snit
In the past I had seen 80-90%.
Its even higher than that now with the new more virulent
strains but not known with any certainty yet.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html
That doesn’t say that it only needs to get to 70%.
"What we know about coronavirus so far suggests that,
Suggests isnt your original absolute.
Post by Snit
if we were really to go back to a pre-pandemic lifestyle, we would need at
least 70% of the population
At least isnt the same as your original.
Post by Snit
to be immune to keep the rate of infection down (“achieve herd immunity”)
without restrictions on activities."
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
New York close to 70%
Even that isnt clear.
Post by Snit
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose
That isnt saying that its close to 70%.
Just one politician has made that claim without
citing any scientific basis for making that claim.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will
still not be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
And there is no evidence that the 70% is the required level.
Snit
2021-06-08 00:39:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New
York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
Its nothing like that simple now with the new more virulent strains.
That is what I thought,
That’s what is known.
Post by Snit
but I have found multiple sources saying 70% is what they think would do
it.
None that base that on any rigorous science.
Post by Snit
In the past I had seen 80-90%.
Its even higher than that now with the new more virulent
strains but not known with any certainty yet.
I would not be surprised -- but do you have cites to back that?
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html
That doesn’t say that it only needs to get to 70%.
"What we know about coronavirus so far suggests that,
Suggests isnt your original absolute.
These comments are meant as best guesses, not absolutes. Welcome to English.
:)
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
if we were really to go back to a pre-pandemic lifestyle, we would need at
least 70% of the population
At least isnt the same as your original.
Post by Snit
to be immune to keep the rate of infection down (“achieve herd immunity”)
without restrictions on activities."
You ignored this part.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
New York close to 70%
Even that isnt clear.
Post by Snit
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose
That isnt saying that its close to 70%.
Just one politician has made that claim without
citing any scientific basis for making that claim.
Do you have contrary data?
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will
still not be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
And there is no evidence that the 70% is the required level.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:30:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New
York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
Its nothing like that simple now with the new more virulent strains.
That is what I thought,
That’s what is known.
Post by Snit
but I have found multiple sources saying 70% is what they think would
do it.
None that base that on any rigorous science.
Post by Snit
In the past I had seen 80-90%.
Its even higher than that now with the new more virulent
strains but not known with any certainty yet.
I would not be surprised -- but do you have cites to back that?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-04/what-do-we-know-about-delta-kappa-covid-variants/100190414
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/achieving-herd-immunity-with-covid19.html
That doesn’t say that it only needs to get to 70%.
"What we know about coronavirus so far suggests that,
Suggests isnt your original absolute.
These comments are meant as best guesses, not absolutes.
Easy to say after you have been picked up on your original claim.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
if we were really to go back to a pre-pandemic lifestyle, we would need
at least 70% of the population
At least isnt the same as your original.
Post by Snit
to be immune to keep the rate of infection down (“achieve herd
immunity”) without restrictions on activities."
You ignored this part.
No need to comment on that bit, it was what herd immunity is about.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
New York close to 70%
Even that isnt clear.
Post by Snit
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/new-york/articles/2021-06-07/ny-will-lift-more-virus-rules-once-70-have-a-vaccine-dose
That isnt saying that its close to 70%.
Just one politician has made that claim without
citing any scientific basis for making that claim.
Do you have contrary data?
He made the claim.

He gets to provide the data that substantiates that claim.

That’s how it works.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
That does clarify that it is just one shot, not both -- so they will
still not be quite at the 70% *fully* vaccinated.
And there is no evidence that the 70% is the required level.
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:29:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 12:30:09 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the two senile pests usual endless idiotic senile shit>
--
Bill Wright addressing senile Ozzie cretin Rodent Speed:
"Well you make up a lot of stuff and it's total bollocks most of it."
MID: <pj2b07$1rvs$***@gioia.aioe.org>
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 00:44:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
Snit
2021-06-08 01:14:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 01:35:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
Snit
2021-06-08 02:11:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Jun 7, 2021 at 6:35:00 PM MST, "FromTheRafters" wrot
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where th
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 02:25:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only
mutate in infected people and so the fewer that
get infected, the less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New
York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
A relevant part:

"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.

Herd immunity is only relevant if we have a transmission-blocking
vaccine. If we don’t, then the only way to get herd immunity in the
population is to give everyone the vaccine, says Shweta Bansal, a
mathematical biologist at Georgetown University in Washington D.C.

In the U.S., the predominant variant now circulating is the B.1.1.7,
which is about 60% more transmissible than the initial strain that
first plagued our globe. Experts now believe a threshold of at least 80
percent of the population would need to be immune to significantly slow
or stop the spread. That number could be even higher if more contagious
variants continue to develop."
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:53:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the
best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in
New York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from Moderna
and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing symptomatic
disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
Herd immunity is only relevant if we have a transmission-blocking vaccine.
And we now know that we do.
If we don’t, then the only way to get herd immunity in the population is
to give everyone the vaccine,
That’s wrong too. It doesn’t need to be everyone and
you get herd immunity if enough get infected too.
says Shweta Bansal, a mathematical biologist at Georgetown University in
Washington D.C.
In the U.S., the predominant variant now circulating is the B.1.1.7, which
is about 60% more transmissible than the initial strain that first plagued
our globe. Experts now believe a threshold of at least 80 percent of the
population would need to be immune to significantly slow or stop the
spread. That number could be even higher if more contagious variants
continue to develop."
And its even higher again with the indian and brazil variants.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 03:08:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New
York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from Moderna
and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing symptomatic
disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 03:44:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the
best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in
New York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent
is better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not
enough IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
Pathetic.
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:36:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 13:44:54 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Post by Rod Speed
Pathetic.
Your trolling certainly is, you pathetic octogenerian senile troll!
--
Richard addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"Shit you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID: <ogoa38$pul$***@news.mixmin.net>
Steve Walker
2021-06-08 08:21:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
    Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone
increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the
vaccine?
   Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate
in infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the
less the chance of it mutating.
   Exactly!
    So we should be using it sparingly.
   Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
   Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity
in New York.    Amazing.
  Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
  Gotta link ?
 It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90
percent is better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in
time. Not enough IMO.
 I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
To be fair, reducing transmission may bring the rate down enough that
the virus cannot transmit to enough hosts and dies out, so a reduction
could cause a stop.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 09:54:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
    Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
   Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
   Exactly!
    So we should be using it sparingly.
   Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the
best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
   Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in
New York.    Amazing.
  Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
  Gotta link ?
 It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
 I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
To be fair, reducing transmission may bring the rate down enough that the
virus cannot transmit to enough hosts and dies out, so a reduction could
cause a stop.
True, it could make the difference between exponential growth and
exponential decay but it does not change the fact that being vaccinated
does not mean you cannot host the virus such that it allows a vaccine
resistant strain to emerge from a population.

It is sort of like the antibiotics and living germs. The doctor offers
a course of antibiotics and you must stay the course to kill the germs,
giving up on the course prematurely can result in a resurgence of
resistant germs making the antibiotic ineffective and you worse off
than before.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 10:43:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate
in infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the
less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the
best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity
in New York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent
is better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not
enough IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
To be fair, reducing transmission may bring the rate down enough that the
virus cannot transmit to enough hosts and dies out, so a reduction could
cause a stop.
True, it could make the difference between exponential growth and
exponential decay but it does not change the fact that being vaccinated
does not mean you cannot host the virus such that it allows a vaccine
resistant strain to emerge from a population.
In fact vaccination dramatically reduces the risk of getting
infected and so being a breeding ground for mutations.
Post by FromTheRafters
It is sort of like the antibiotics and living germs.
Nothing like in fact. Vaccination doesn't kill all but
the best mutants, it stops the vast majority of the
vaccinated from getting infected and becoming
a host for the virus.
Post by FromTheRafters
The doctor offers a course of antibiotics and you must stay the course to
kill the germs, giving up on the course prematurely can result in a
resurgence of resistant germs making the antibiotic ineffective and you
worse off than before.
Vaccination doesn't work like that because the vaccine
doesn't kill the virus, it just activates the immune system
and stops most becoming infected.
Peeler
2021-06-08 12:22:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 20:43:52 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Sqwertz to Rodent Speed:
"This is just a hunch, but I'm betting you're kinda an argumentative
asshole.
MID: <ev1p6ml7ywd5$***@sqwertz.com>
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 13:31:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase
the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less
the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the
best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in
New York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent
is better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not
enough IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
To be fair, reducing transmission may bring the rate down enough that the
virus cannot transmit to enough hosts and dies out, so a reduction could
cause a stop.
True, it could make the difference between exponential growth and
exponential decay but it does not change the fact that being vaccinated
does not mean you cannot host the virus such that it allows a vaccine
resistant strain to emerge from a population.
In fact vaccination dramatically reduces the risk of getting
infected and so being a breeding ground for mutations.
True.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It is sort of like the antibiotics and living germs.
Nothing like in fact. Vaccination doesn't kill all but
the best mutants, it stops the vast majority of the
vaccinated from getting infected and becoming
a host for the virus.
The virus has to get there to be dealt with, and it is not dealt with
immediately. So, there is some shedding before the virus is eliminated
from the body.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
The doctor offers a course of antibiotics and you must stay the course to
kill the germs, giving up on the course prematurely can result in a
resurgence of resistant germs making the antibiotic ineffective and you
worse off than before.
Vaccination doesn't work like that because the vaccine
doesn't kill the virus,
Of course not, a virus isn't alive in the first place.
Post by Rod Speed
it just activates the immune system and stops most becoming infected.
It causes presenter cells to recruit generator cells to generate
antibodies to be ready to "detect" and attach to the (nearly) specific
pathogen by the shapes on its surface. Some pathogens with partial or
no coverage by antibodies can and do infect cells and reproduce. Having
the antibodies present before the 'wild' antigen invades gives your
system a head start but it is not the all or nothing proposition you
seem to think it is.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 17:44:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Steve Walker
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone
increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the
vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate
in infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the
less the chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with
the best vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity
in New York. Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90
percent is better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in
time. Not enough IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
"At this point, data is not yet clear on whether the vaccines from
Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, while highly effective at preventing
symptomatic disease, also stop the spread of the virus.
That part is just plain wrong.
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/mounting-evidence-suggests-covid-vaccines-do-reduc
So the words 'reduce' and 'stop' are synonyms to you?
To be fair, reducing transmission may bring the rate down enough that
the virus cannot transmit to enough hosts and dies out, so a reduction
could cause a stop.
True, it could make the difference between exponential growth and
exponential decay but it does not change the fact that being vaccinated
does not mean you cannot host the virus such that it allows a vaccine
resistant strain to emerge from a population.
In fact vaccination dramatically reduces the risk of getting
infected and so being a breeding ground for mutations.
True.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It is sort of like the antibiotics and living germs.
Nothing like in fact. Vaccination doesn't kill all but
the best mutants, it stops the vast majority of the
vaccinated from getting infected and becoming
a host for the virus.
The virus has to get there to be dealt with,
Vaccination doesn't deal with any virus, it gets the body's
immune system activated so you are much less likely to
be infected by the virus and so greatly reduces the
chance of the virus to mutate in that individual.
Post by FromTheRafters
and it is not dealt with immediately. So, there is some shedding before
the virus is eliminated from the body.
In fact once the body's immune system has been activated
by the vaccination, you are far less likely to get infected at
all and so there isnt any shedding of the virus because that
can only happen if the virus is reproducing in the body.
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
The doctor offers a course of antibiotics and you must stay the course
to kill the germs, giving up on the course prematurely can result in a
resurgence of resistant germs making the antibiotic ineffective and you
worse off than before.
Vaccination doesn't work like that because the vaccine doesn't kill the
virus,
Of course not, a virus isn't alive in the first place.
But bacteria is, so what happens with bacteria and antibiotics
is nothing like what happens with vaccination and viruses.
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
it just activates the immune system and stops most becoming infected.
It causes presenter cells to recruit generator cells to generate
antibodies to be ready to "detect" and attach to the (nearly) specific
pathogen by the shapes on its surface.
And so is nothing even remotely like an antibiotic.
Post by FromTheRafters
Some pathogens with partial or no coverage by antibodies can and do infect
cells and reproduce.
Irrelevant to how vaccines and viruses work.
Post by FromTheRafters
Having the antibodies present before the 'wild' antigen invades gives your
system a head start but it is not the all or nothing proposition you seem
to think it is.
I never ever said anything about all or nothing.

Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:46:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough
IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
https://www.biospace.com/article/experts-ditch-the-dream-of-covid-19-herd-immunity-/
I was thinking in terms of the US. But, yes, if there are mutations where
the
immunity is reduced then the idea of herd immunity goes out the window.
It isnt about immunity reduction, its about an increased R0 and we know that
has happened, significantly.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-04/what-do-we-know-about-delta-kappa-covid-variants/100190414
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:31:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 12:46:54 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH yet more of the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Richard addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"Shit you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID: <ogoa38$pul$***@news.mixmin.net>
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:34:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in
infected people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the
chance of it mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think, 85 to 90 percent is
better but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time. Not enough IMO.
I have the same feeling -- but no evidence to back it.
You do actually with the R0 of the new more virulent strains.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:33:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
Nope, it's the reverse of that, the virus can only mutate in infected
people and so the fewer that get infected, the less the chance of it
mutating.
Exactly!
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
Nope, we should be vaccinating as many as possible with the best
vaccines to reduce the number who get infected.
Yup. And they are nearing what they think is herd immunity in New York.
Amazing.
Dunno, nothing useful on that with
https://www.google.com/search?q=herd+immunity+in+New+York
Gotta link ?
Did more looking into this.
It is COVID fatigue causing compromises I think,
There is no compromise involved.
Post by FromTheRafters
85 to 90 percent is better
And necessary with the newer more virulent strains.
Post by FromTheRafters
but 70 sounds more "doable" at this point in time.
Corse a lower number is more doable.
Post by FromTheRafters
Not enough IMO.
Paul
2021-06-07 18:42:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Look up terms like "evolutionary pressure" and "genetic drift".

Whether humans developed "herd immunity" by natural infection,
or developed immunity-by-vaccination, the evolutionary pressure
is the same. The unsuccessful variants are crushed, only to
be replaced by new variants. See "seasonal flu", for an example
of a dynamic equilibrium. (Genetic drift there, easily invalidates
this years flu shot, when next year rolls around.)

The difference between the two scenarios, is a lot more people
die in the natural infection case. And the variants still appear,
because there are so many "incubation cauldrons" for the
natural infection case. There is added misery, because there
are no beds for everyone (see India for examples of what that
looks like - throwing bodies in the Ganges!). Are you a floater ?
Is there a body of water nearby, for your disposal ? These
are things to consider with the "natural infection" scenario,
like whether you're a floater or not. Others will place bets,
on how far out to sea you'll get, before you're eaten.

Paul
Peeler
2021-06-07 19:03:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 14:42:44 -0400, Paul, another brain dead, troll-feeding,
Post by Paul
Look up terms like "evolutionary pressure" and "genetic drift".
He won't, troll-feeding senile moron! He will only look how to bait more and
more of you senile idiots with ever more idiotic baits of his! <BG>
Snit
2021-06-07 19:14:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?
No. It reduces the number of times it mutates and thus reduces the chance of
new strains. Hence it is important we help as many people as possible get it.
Post by Commander Kinsey
So we should be using it sparingly.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Peeler
2021-06-07 20:24:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 19:14:21 GMT, Shit the git, the notorious,
Post by Snit
No. It reduces the number of times
Just what does it take to reduce the number of times you will be sucking
that filthy troll's cock, senile Shit the Git?
FromTheRafters
2021-06-07 19:48:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.

The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.

The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
Snit
2021-06-07 19:59:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
%
2021-06-07 20:02:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
i've had 3 shots already
Michael Chare
2021-06-07 21:06:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by %
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first
anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
i've had 3 shots already
How did you manage that? What does the NHS app tell you?
--
Michael Chare
Joey
2021-06-07 22:23:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Michael Chare
Post by %
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
i've had 3 shots already
How did you manage that?
He's a yank troll.
Post by Michael Chare
What does the NHS app tell you?
Fuck off yank troll in appropriate bureaucratic
language if it side loads it on an android phone.
Peeler
2021-06-07 22:33:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 08:23:20 +1000, Joey, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:

<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 86-year-old senile Australian
cretin's pathological trolling:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/
Richard
2021-06-08 04:38:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by %
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first
anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
i've had 3 shots already
an
How did you manage that?  What does the NHS app tell you?
The NHS app gives the date administered, name of vaccine and batch
number Also has links to FAQs etc.
Snit
2021-06-07 23:14:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by %
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than first anticipated in
terms of preventing the disease at all.
i've had 3 shots already
How much time is left on the shot clock?
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 22:08:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than
first anticipated in terms of preventing the disease at all.
Not just seems to, has been proven to do that now.
Peeler
2021-06-07 22:23:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 08:08:12 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the two abnormal senile assholes' latest idiotic, senile blather>
--
"Who or What is Rod Speed?
Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
man" on the InterNet."
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/
Snit
2021-06-07 23:09:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Jun 7, 2021 at 3:08:12 PM MST, ""Rod Speed"" wrot
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than
first anticipated in terms of preventing the disease at all.
Not just seems to, has been proven to do that now.
I could quibble over semantics and scientific terms, but in general languag
agreed.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 23:33:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than
first anticipated in terms of preventing the disease at all.
Not just seems to, has been proven to do that now.
I could quibble over semantics and scientific terms,
No you couldn’t with that, it has been proven.
Post by Snit
but in general language agreed.
Snit
2021-06-08 00:43:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than
first anticipated in terms of preventing the disease at all.
Not just seems to, has been proven to do that now.
I could quibble over semantics and scientific terms,
No you couldn’t with that, it has been proven.
By all means show the proof (not just support).
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
but in general language agreed.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:31:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the
virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually. I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We have heard about
bacteria being resistant due to overuse of antibacterials and
antibiotics. This is a little different.
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population who continue to
harbor the virus, there will always be some for one reason or another.
The bigger the host population the more the viruses environment shapes
the newer generations. Resistance can build.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus and
spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated. This is no magic bullet, it is
just another common-sense weapon in the battle against the virus.
The good news is the vaccines seem to work better than
first anticipated in terms of preventing the disease at all.
Not just seems to, has been proven to do that now.
I could quibble over semantics and scientific terms,
No you couldn’t with that, it has been proven.
By all means show the proof (not just support).
You are free to chase that up for yourself.
Post by Snit
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Snit
but in general language agreed.
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:33:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 12:31:16 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH more of the two senile pests' usual endless idiotic senile shit>
--
Marland answering senile Rodent's statement, "I don't leak":
"That’s because so much piss and shite emanates from your gob that there is
nothing left to exit normally, your arsehole has clammed shut through disuse
and the end of prick is only clear because you are such a Wanker."
Message-ID: <***@mid.individual.net>
Peeler
2021-06-07 20:26:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 07 Jun 2021 15:48:07 -0400, FromTheRafters, another mentally
Post by FromTheRafters
Good point actually.
Another idiotic troll actually, and nothing else, you mentally deficient
troll-feeding senile asshole!
Rod Speed
2021-06-07 22:05:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone
increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid
the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Post by FromTheRafters
I questioned this earlier as I was thinking about
in the USA we have basically three vaccines. We
have heard about bacteria being resistant due to
overuse of antibacterials and antibiotics. This is a
little different.
Completely different in fact. Antibiotics kill bacteria
and are not always 100% successful, and that's what
produces resistance. Vaccination stops infection and
so the virus doesn't get to mutate in that individual.
Post by FromTheRafters
The greatest threat is in the unvaccinated population
who continue to harbor the virus, there will always be
some for one reason or another.
Not necessarily, we eliminated smallpox
from the wild by vaccination. And havent
quite done that yet with polio because
a few countrys refused to vaccinate.
Post by FromTheRafters
The bigger the host population the more
the viruses environment shapes the newer
generations. Resistance can build.
Not in those who don't get infected because
they have been vaccinated and the more that
have been vaccinated, the fewer infected
people there are for the virus to mutate in.
Post by FromTheRafters
The other point is, vaccinated people can
still host the virus and spread it to others,
Yes, but far fewer of those do that than the unvaccinated.
Post by FromTheRafters
they are just less likely to get the serious
disease outcome than the unvaccinated.
That's just plain wrong. Vaccination dramatically
reduces the chance of being infected at all.
Post by FromTheRafters
This is no magic bullet,
Vaccination has in fact been just that with smallpox
and quite a few other viruses too. It hasn't been
with influenza and the common cold because
they mutate much faster than most viruses.
Post by FromTheRafters
it is just another common-sense
weapon in the battle against the virus.
It is in fact by far the most effective weapon
against the virus apart from isolation which
isnt practical for most people.
Peeler
2021-06-07 22:24:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
"Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed is an
insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can enhance his own
self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard man" on the
InterNet."

https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/
--
John addressing the senile Australian pest:
"You are a complete idiot. But you make me larf. LOL"
MID: <f9056fe6-1479-40ff-8cc0-***@googlegroups.com>
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 01:26:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100
percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus. It seems you don't
understand how viruses mutate or how vaccines work.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 02:41:05 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone
increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid
the vaccine? So we should be using it sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it
is 100 percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Post by FromTheRafters
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
Post by FromTheRafters
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.

The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically
reduce the rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't
just reduce the rate of severe infection and death as you
previously claimed in another of your posts.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 03:28:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100 percent
effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Yes, it needs a host.
Post by Rod Speed
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
I didn't say it wasn't, I said the OP had a good point.
Post by Rod Speed
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.
The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically reduce the
rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't just reduce the rate of
severe infection and death as you previously claimed in another of your
posts.
I didn't say that. I said:

"vaccinated people can still host the virus and spread it to others"

This means that while hosting the virus their systems present an
environmental selection against the currently targeted shapes of the
various vaccines' antibodies.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 03:46:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100
percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Yes, it needs a host.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
I didn't say it wasn't, I said the OP had a good point.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.
The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically reduce the
rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't just reduce the
rate of severe infection and death as you previously claimed in another
of your posts.
"vaccinated people can still host the virus and spread it to others"
That wasn't your original post that I was referring to there.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 03:48:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100
percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Yes, it needs a host.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
I didn't say it wasn't, I said the OP had a good point.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.
The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically reduce the
rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't just reduce the
rate of severe infection and death as you previously claimed in another
of your posts.
I didn't say that.
Yes you did, here it is again.

The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus
and spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the
serious disease outcome than the unvaccinated.
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:34:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 13:48:53 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Sqwertz to Rodent Speed:
"This is just a hunch, but I'm betting you're kinda an argumentative
asshole.
MID: <ev1p6ml7ywd5$***@sqwertz.com>
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 09:59:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100
percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Yes, it needs a host.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
I didn't say it wasn't, I said the OP had a good point.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.
The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically reduce the
rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't just reduce the rate
of severe infection and death as you previously claimed in another of your
posts.
I didn't say that.
Yes you did, here it is again.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus
and spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the
serious disease outcome than the unvaccinated.
That is true, the vaccines make it less likely to get serious disease,
they do not make it impossible to host the virus.

Thanks for clearing that up.
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 10:53:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the
chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should
be using it sparingly.
Good point actually.
Nope, shows a complete misunderstanding of how viruses mutate.
Only if you take his "everyone" literally and assume that it is 100
percent effective at preventing "hosting" the virus.
Doesn't need to be anything like 100% effective at reducing
the chance of getting infected to radically reduce the number
of hosts that the virus can reproduce in. That's the only way
it can mutate, by reproducing.
Yes, it needs a host.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
It seems you don't understand how viruses mutate
My original statement is completely accurate.
I didn't say it wasn't, I said the OP had a good point.
Post by Rod Speed
Post by FromTheRafters
or how vaccines work.
And so is my later elaboration on that too.
The best of the covid vaccines have been shown to dramatically reduce
the rate of covid infection in the vaccinated. They don't just reduce
the rate of severe infection and death as you previously claimed in
another of your posts.
I didn't say that.
Yes you did, here it is again.
The other point is, vaccinated people can still host the virus
and spread it to others, they are just less likely to get the
serious disease outcome than the unvaccinated.
That is true,
Nope, very misleadingly stated.
Post by FromTheRafters
the vaccines make it less likely to get serious disease, they do not make
it impossible to host the virus.
In fact they radically reduce the risk of hosting the
virus so the phucker is just plain wrong, as I said.
Post by FromTheRafters
Thanks for clearing that up.
Peeler
2021-06-08 12:22:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 20:53:17 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Richard about senile Rodent:
"Rod Speed, a bare faced pig and ignorant twat."
MID: <r5uoe4$1kqo$***@gioia.aioe.org>
Maskless Sociopath
2021-06-07 20:14:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it sparingly.
COVID-19 had no effect on me so I'm not concerned about COVID-20. LOL
Peeler
2021-06-07 20:53:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 7 Jun 2021 16:14:16 -0400, Maskless Sociopath, another brain dead
Post by Maskless Sociopath
COVID-19 had no effect on me so I'm not concerned about COVID-20. LOL
The trolling attention whore thanks you nicely for making yet another
absolutely idiotic and off topic thread a success! <tsk>
Brian Gaff (Sofa)
2021-06-08 06:52:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic sequences
are more error prone on copying than dna ones. Thus its swings and
roundabouts. as has been proved with Flu. IE even if you did not get the
yearly flu jab, some immunity remains but due to mutation you will still
get ill, that is why they give a basket of various best guess mutations to
you. The same effect will occur here, as has been proved with many other
viruses including the close relative known as Sars 1.

There is no perfect answer but we can respond faster than the virus can, as
the virus is basically mutating all the time and its only those where
mutations mean it can do its job better that stay in the population. All the
common colds we get were probably once serious virus that would kill us, but
over te years the immunity has improved faster than the mutations to get
around these. You have to remember that viruses are not thinking creatures
they are just driven by a simple chemical key that hijacks cells to make
more virus. Its not clear why they exist, but in our universe, anything that
can occur will occur, so looking for a reason is pointless.
Brian
--
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
***@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
~BD~
2021-06-08 07:00:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic sequences
are more error prone on copying than dna ones. Thus its swings and
roundabouts. as has been proved with Flu. IE even if you did not get the
yearly flu jab, some immunity remains but due to mutation you will still
get ill, that is why they give a basket of various best guess mutations to
you. The same effect will occur here, as has been proved with many other
viruses including the close relative known as Sars 1.
There is no perfect answer but we can respond faster than the virus can, as
the virus is basically mutating all the time and its only those where
mutations mean it can do its job better that stay in the population. All the
common colds we get were probably once serious virus that would kill us, but
over te years the immunity has improved faster than the mutations to get
around these. You have to remember that viruses are not thinking creatures
they are just driven by a simple chemical key that hijacks cells to make
more virus. Its not clear why they exist, but in our universe, anything that
can occur will occur, so looking for a reason is pointless.
Brian
Nice to hear from you, Brian.

Stay safe. :-D
Rod Speed
2021-06-08 07:36:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no.
No and no, actually.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
The problem is it mutates in any case,
Viruses can only mutate in an infected person.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
as RNA genetic sequences are more error prone on copying than dna ones.
Thus its swings and roundabouts. as has been proved with Flu.
Nope, not with covid.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
IE even if you did not get the yearly flu jab, some immunity remains but
due to mutation you will still get ill, that is why they give a basket of
various best guess mutations to you.
But so far only one covid strain has been shown to
infect someone who has been previously infected.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
The same effect will occur here,
Nope, for that reason.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
as has been proved with many other viruses including the close relative
known as Sars 1.
SARS didn’t infect more than once.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
There is no perfect answer
There is on that question he asked, vaccinate most
people and it will no longer be a problem, as we
have seen with measles, mumps, scarlet fever,
yellow fever, polio, smallpox etc etc etc.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
but we can respond faster than the virus can,
It’s the reverse actually.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
as the virus is basically mutating all the time
But not necessarily getting better all the time.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
and its only those where mutations mean it can do its job better that stay
in the population.
That mangles the real story too given that be best
vaccines do currently appear to be effective against
most or maybe even all the variants, unlike with flu.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
All the common colds we get were probably once serious virus that would
kill us,
That’s not true either.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
but over te years the immunity has improved faster than the mutations to
get around these.
If that was true, the common cold would have killed
those savages who had no immunity when infected
white men showed up and we know that didn’t happen.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
You have to remember that viruses are not thinking creatures they are just
driven by a simple chemical key that hijacks cells to make more virus. Its
not clear why they exist,
Basically they evolved, just like everything else did.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
but in our universe, anything that can occur will occur,
That’s not true either.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
so looking for a reason is pointless.
We already know the reason, evolution.
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine? So we should be using it
sparingly.
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:27:21 UTC
Reply
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On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 17:36:16 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no.
No and no, actually.
In auto-contradicting mode again, you abnormal trolling senile pest? LOL
--
Bod addressing abnormal senile quarreller Rot:
"Do you practice arguing with yourself in an empty room?"
MID: <***@mid.individual.net>
Peeler
2021-06-08 08:25:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 07:52:36 +0100, Brainless & Daft, the notorious,
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no.
Yes, YOU disgusting troll-feeding senile cretin were still missing on the
list of the troll-feeding sick assholes here! Do you blind swine know no
shame at all? <tsk>
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 10:07:26 UTC
Reply
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Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic sequences
are more error prone on copying than dna ones.
As I understand it, it has a proofreader function which reduces the
mutation rate. Damage that and it might step up the rate.
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 10:21:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic sequences
are more error prone on copying than dna ones.
As I understand it, it has a proofreader function which reduces the mutation
rate. Damage that and it might step up the rate.
Coronavirus Proofreading Mechanism

RNA virus replication typically has a high error rate (or low viral
fidelity) that results in the virus existing as diverse populations
of genome mutants or ‘‘quasispecies’’ (Denison et al., 2011).
While low replicative fidelity allows the RNA viruses to adapt
to different replicative environments and selective pressures,
it is also associated with an increased chance of error catas-
trophe leading to viral extinction.

https://www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765(20)30518-9.pdf
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 10:25:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic
sequences are more error prone on copying than dna ones.
As I understand it, it has a proofreader function which reduces the
mutation rate. Damage that and it might step up the rate.
Coronavirus Proofreading Mechanism
RNA virus replication typically has a high error rate (or low viral
fidelity) that results in the virus existing as diverse populations
of genome mutants or ‘‘quasispecies’’ (Denison et al., 2011).
While low replicative fidelity allows the RNA viruses to adapt
to different replicative environments and selective pressures,
it is also associated with an increased chance of error catas-
trophe leading to viral extinction.
https://www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765(20)30518-9.pdf
https%3A//www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765%2820%2930518-9.pdf
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 10:28:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by Brian Gaff (Sofa)
Yes and no. The problem is it mutates in any case, as RNA genetic
sequences are more error prone on copying than dna ones.
As I understand it, it has a proofreader function which reduces the
mutation rate. Damage that and it might step up the rate.
Coronavirus Proofreading Mechanism
RNA virus replication typically has a high error rate (or low viral
fidelity) that results in the virus existing as diverse populations
of genome mutants or ‘‘quasispecies’’ (Denison et al., 2011).
While low replicative fidelity allows the RNA viruses to adapt
to different replicative environments and selective pressures,
it is also associated with an increased chance of error catas-
trophe leading to viral extinction.
https://www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765(20)30518-9.pdf
https%3A//www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765%2820%2930518-9.pdf
Third time's a charm.

https://www.cell.com/molecular-cell/pdf/S1097-2765%2820%2930518-9.pdf

My client showed the previous links to be broken, I escaped the string
and made it worse. This one should work.
Pancho
2021-06-08 10:35:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
That depends...

Mutation pressure depends on how frequently virons try to establish
themselves in a vaccinated host.

The more vaccinated people there are, the more likely that a single
viron will find a vaccinated host. On the other hand vaccinating people
may reduce the prevalence of disease, the total number of virons. So
less virons come into contact with any host. The expected number of
virons trying to infect a vaccinated host will be a function of both.

A consequence of this is that it *may* be a bad idea to vaccinate in the
middle of a surge. That would depend on a lot of factors which I don't
know the answer to. So I'm just a fuckwit on the internet, idly pondering.

Maybe epidemiologists know the answer, but I haven't heard many
discussing it.
Pancho
2021-06-08 10:37:15 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
That depends...
Mutation pressure
I meant evolutionary pressure.
Bob F
2021-06-08 17:39:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by Pancho
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances
of the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
What you don't want to do is give everybody too weak of a dose to be
effective, which is what happens with meat animals, creating resistant
bacteria.

https://milesobrien.com/antibiotics-farm-mystery/
Post by Pancho
Post by Pancho
That depends...
Mutation pressure
I meant evolutionary pressure.
Peeler
2021-06-08 12:21:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 11:35:16 +0100, Pancho, another mentally deficient
Post by Pancho
Maybe epidemiologists know the answer, but I haven't heard many
discussing it.
Ever heard of that little adage, "Don't feed the troll", troll-feeding
senile moron?
FromTheRafters
2021-06-08 13:37:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pancho
Post by Commander Kinsey
Doesn't giving a coronavirus vaccine to everyone increase the chances of
the virus mutating to avoid the vaccine?  So we should be using it
sparingly.
That depends...
Mutation pressure depends on how frequently virons try to establish
themselves in a vaccinated host.
The more vaccinated people there are, the more likely that a single viron
will find a vaccinated host. On the other hand vaccinating people may reduce
the prevalence of disease, the total number of virons. So less virons come
into contact with any host. The expected number of virons trying to infect a
vaccinated host will be a function of both.
A consequence of this is that it *may* be a bad idea to vaccinate in the
middle of a surge. That would depend on a lot of factors which I don't know
the answer to. So I'm just a fuckwit on the internet, idly pondering.
Maybe epidemiologists know the answer, but I haven't heard many discussing
it.
I had heard that about the vaccines too. You don't necessarily want to
vaccinate while the virus is in exponential growth, it is more
effective when other measures have brought the R_eff value down.
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